Definitions: A Triumph!

[cjsmith]

I finally figured out the difference between "immoral" and "unethical".

For years people have tried to nitpick at me by saying those two words have different meanings. Looking at dictionaries hasn't helped me. Way too many definitions of "immoral" reference "ethics" and way too many definitions of "unethical" reference "morals." So I figured the nitpickers were just making shit up, as many nitpickers do. But I figured it out!

"Immoral" is a word REPUBLICANS use. "Unethical" is a word DEMOCRATS use.

Ta-daaaa!

Comments

[meep.livejournal.com]

Let me be a little more precise:

People generally use the word "unethical" when the context is business-type dealings, and "immoral" when it deals with interpersonal relationships and non-biz type things.

So cheating on your husband is immoral, and taking advantage of a company position to benefit a side business you own is unethical (like a doctor referring patients to an MRI center he partly owns, though they can get it cheaper, faster elsewhere.)

[platypuslord.livejournal.com]

*applause*

[lkeele.livejournal.com]

Thank you! That's very helpful. I encountered this teaching my ethics class -- some folks believed, to the very end of class, that ethics and morals were different, and unethical and immoral were different as well, and I sure as shit couldn't see a difference.

Now I'm better prepared the next time I teach this class. :)

[joedecker.livejournal.com]

Gads, I wonder which I use more?

[tiger-spot.livejournal.com]

The way I usually use the words [which I think is just me; the dictionary will not back me up here], "morals" are the general principles you're following (e.g., "Killing is wrong" or "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you") and "ethics" are how you apply those principles to specific situations ("Is it okay to kill in self-defense?" or "Well, I wouldn't want to be hit in the head with a fish, but he asked for it...").

So I might say something was "immoral" if I thought it were always, in all circumstances, wrong (although I probably wouldn't because it's got too many religious connotations), but that something were "unethical" if I thought it might sometimes be justified, but not in the situation in question.

That said:

"Immoral" is a word REPUBLICANS use. "Unethical" is a word DEMOCRATS use.

You are exactly right.

[mithriltabby]

Interesting. Usually I use “morals” to describe behavioral principles founded in religious dogma and “ethics” to describe behavioral principles founded in objective arguments.

[platypus]

I don't use the word 'moral' because I feel like it has a connotation of religiousness. I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone call some variation of sexuality "unethical."

But then, if I had to pick, I suppose I'd say I was Democratic :). I'm not terribly fond of either side of two-party politics, but...

[dieppe.livejournal.com]

I like that explanation too, slothman! Which explains also why "immoral" is a word Republicans use. They may tend towards religious dogma to determine morality. Whereas the nasty immoral atheists and Democrats would use "ethics" from objective arguments, free of "The Bible Tells Me So."

In a sense it also explains things like why Slavery, supported by the Bible, lasted as long as it did. People who take their morality (and ethics) based on a book can say "See! It's okay to do this because the Book says so!" and feel that their morality is justified. Also explains why there are Christian who smoke cigarettes, but won't drink. The Bible doesn't say that tobacco is bad for you, but it does talk against "strong drink."

Anyway, I'll be thinking about this all day.

[cjsmith.livejournal.com]

Fair enough. I don't *think* I'd automatically use those words that way, but it's believable. Plus it totally explains the Democrat/Republican split! ;-)

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

Wow. I think you may have described the way I was instinctively driven to use those words without knowing why.

(And yes, Republicans would be the ones with the tendency toward black-and-white thinking.)

[elflet.livejournal.com]

*cackle* oh, that's wonderful!

I've been using a definition that came from one of Theodore Sturgeon's stories: morals are about your own survival, ethics are about your species' survival.

ripping something out quickly...

[lrc.livejournal.com]

I like that. I think it reflects the dichotomy of worldviews.

I think that the general basis is that morals are handed down from on high. God said that it is wrong, so doing it is immoral.

Ethics tend to be based on treating your fellow man fairly. They can generally be derived from some permutation of the golden rule.

Conservatives (or authoritarians) tend to believe that morals are important, and that if you live a moral life (follow the rules) being ethical will follow.

Liberals, (or non-authoritarians) believe in workng out what is right based on principles like the golden rule. What authority says is not as important as doing the right thing.

[dpolicar]

Heh.

My usual division is along the absolute/relative line. That is, the more a particular "X is wrong" seems to need a "for Y-type people to do in Z circumstances" in order to be true, the more I consider it a statement of ethics rather than morals.

This is most explicitly true for professional ethics, of course. It's a violation of professional ethics for a lawyer to discuss a case with the judge in private, but I wouldn't be inclined to call it immoral.

Which means, for me, that to say something is "unethical" without a context established is to say something somewhat incoherent.

[hitchhiker.livejournal.com]

that's brilliant :)

[hitchhiker.livejournal.com]

if nothing else, there was 'the ethical slut'

[thorswitch.livejournal.com]

Interesting - I'd always kind of perceived the difference as being that moral issues tend to be related to the kinds of things that religious dogma tends to address, where as ethical matters tend to be more secular in origin. But looking at it as interpersonal / business seems to cover the same kind of territory in a much less emotionally charged manner than framing it as religious / secular. Thanks - that's some insight that might come in real handy during other debates :D